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Zechariah 4:14 two anointed

Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:56 pm
by Danielkim
Then he said, These two sons of oil are those that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.(Jubilee bible 2000)

וַיֹּ֕אמֶר אֵ֖לֶּה שְׁנֵ֣י בְנֵֽי־הַיִּצְהָ֑ר הָעֹמְדִ֖ים עַל־אֲדֹ֥ון כָּל־הָאָֽרֶץ׃

Hello Everyone.

I have one important question.

I am trying to figure out if two olive trees are literally two people or eveybody who stand by Lord on this earth.

I would like to know if this verse has meaning that these two anointed ones are actually multiple in numbers or it is only two people.

please help.

Re: Zechariah 4:14 two anointed

Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:55 pm
by SteveMiller
Daniel,
The Jubilee 2000 translation is quite unusual here. It is the only translation that I have seen that places the "are" where it does.
The way Jubilee translated, the verse could mean that the 2 sons of oil are many people, but that is not correct.
All other translations translate it something like, These are the 2 sons of fresh oil who stand by the Lord of the whole earth.
By placing the "are" after "these", it is clear that the 2 olive trees are 2 people.

The reasons I think Jubilee is wrong here are:

1. Zechariah asked "What are these 2 olive trees?" (v11) and "What are the 2 fruitful olive branches? (v12).
He did not ask, What are these 2 sons of oil?
So when Zech asks, What are these 2 olive trees?, the angel should respond "These 2 olive trees are ..." or "These are ...", but not "These 2 sons of oil are ...".

2. To translate it as "These 2 sons of oil are" the Hebrew word for "these" אֵלֶּה should come after "the 2 sons of oil", not before, as it does in 3:7 (these that stand), 4:10 "these 7", 4:11 "these 2 olive trees", 8:9 "these days" and "these words", 8:15 "these days", 13:6 "these wounds".
Also, because "the sons of oil" has the definite article, "these" should also have the definite article as it does in all the above verses except 4:10 because "seven" does not have the definite article.

3. Zechariah asks the angel many "What are ...?" questions and the angel always answers "These are ....". Jubilee 2000 translates all the answers from the angel as "these are" except for 4:14.
1:9 What are these (horses)? 1:10 These are ...
2:2 (1:19 English) What are these (4 horns)? ... These are ...
2:4 (1:21) What are these (4 workmen) come to do? ... These are ... and these are come to ....
4:4 What are these (entire lampstand scene)? ... 4:6 This is ...
4:11 What are these 2 olive trees? 4:12 What are the 2 fruitful olive branches? ... 4:14 These are ...
6:4 What are these (4 chariots)? 6:5 These are ...

4. Rev 11:4 says that the 2 olive trees are 2 specific people.

Re: Zechariah 4:14 two anointed

Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 7:12 am
by Danielkim
thank you for your attention to my question and detailed answer.

one more related question.

do you think 3 days and half is literal or symbol of 3 years and half? ( Rev 11: 9)

I am just curious.

Re: Zechariah 4:14 two anointed

Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 4:58 pm
by SteveMiller
You're welcome Daniel. It's 3.5 days.