B-Hebrew: The Biblical Hebrew Forum

Jason Hare wrote:Here's the next one, guys:

(6) David brought the priest near unto him and he inquired of [בּ] the Lord saying, ‘Wilt Thou give this city in my hand when I shall fight against it?’

This sentence is so unlike anything in Biblical Hebrew that anyone who tried to translate it close to word for word will end up with a mish-mash of what? There’s nothing like this in Tanakh. But an idea of how an ancient Israelite may have said this idea can be found by looking at 1 Kings 1:28, 32, 2 Samuel 5:19, 1 Samuel 17 …

Hidden Text

[right]ויקרא דוד לו לכהן וישאל ביהוה לאמר התלך עמי אל העיר הזאת להלחם בה התתנה בידי[/right]

Or a more direct translation of what I wrote, “David summoned the priest to him in order to ask of the Lord saying, ‘Will you go with me unto this city to war against it? Will you give it into my hand?’”

Karl W. Randolph.

the usage of root קרב in Hiphil as bringing someone near is quite common in the Torah.
Such as: Levi 8:13

**
And you already gave a reference to 2Sam which it is in the 1st person
so why did you write התלך and not האלך להלחם or האעלה על?

Next one!

(7) Jacob saw Rachel and he drew near unto her and he said, ‘The daughter of whom art thou?’; and she said unto him, ‘I am the daughter of Laban’. And Jacob told (to) her that he (was) the son of her father’s sister.

(7) Jacob saw Rachel and he drew near unto her and he said, ‘The daughter of whom art thou?’; and she said unto him, ‘I am the daughter of Laban’. And Jacob told (to) her that he (was) the son of her father’s sister.

My submission:

Hidden Text

(7) וַיַּרְא יַעֲקֹב אֶת־רָחֵל וַיִּגַּשׁ אֵלֶיהָ וַיֹּאמַר בַּת־מִי אַתְּ וַתֹּ֫אמֶר לוֹ בַּת־לָבָן אָנֹכִי וַיֹּ֫אמֶר לָהּ יַעֲקֹב כִּי הוּא בֶּן־אֲחוֹת אָבִיהָ׃

The "he drew near unto her" of this exercise is surely to contrast with the "he brought him near unto him" in the previous exercise. That is, the niphal is being contrasted with the hiphil, and both should be related to the root נג״שׁ: intransitive as וַיִּגַּשׁ (niphal) and transitive as וַיַּגֵּשׁ (hiphil). Not using that root in the previous exercise would have caused us to miss this connection.

Jason Hare wrote:Next one!

(7) Jacob saw Rachel and he drew near unto her and he said, ‘The daughter of whom art thou?’; and she said unto him, ‘I am the daughter of Laban’. And Jacob told (to) her that he (was) the son of her father’s sister.

This one was pretty easy. Basically take Genesis 29:10–12, delete many words and make a few other tweaks, then it came up.

Hidden Text

[right]וירא יעקב את רחל ויגש אליה ויאמר בת מי את ותאמר בת לבן אנכי ויגד לה כי בן אחות אביה הוא[/right]

Karl W. Randolph.

kwrandolph wrote:This one was pretty easy. Basically take Genesis 29:10–12, delete many words and make a few other tweaks, then it came up.

I literally type it out with my keyboard and add vowels when I've finished the construction. It is, after all, a composition challenge. If you have an on-screen keyboard, maybe you could use that to peck out the letters?

♥

Jason Hare wrote:I literally type it out with my keyboard and add vowels when I've finished the construction. It is, after all, a composition challenge. If you have an on-screen keyboard, maybe you could use that to peck out the letters?

I can switch keyboards on my computer then touch type Hebrew. But I never bothered to learn the vowel points because I never use them.

The composition part in an exercise like this is to know where the copying and pasting stop, and the tweaking begins. The tweaking is original composition. Over half of what I wrote is tweaking. Even the copying and pasting become original composition when so little of the original is maintained in the final product.

This is not like the previous sentence, where I took examples even from different books in order to come up with something that seemed to fit the meaning of the sentence.

Karl W. Randolph.

kwrandolph wrote:I can switch keyboards on my computer then touch type Hebrew. But I never bothered to learn the vowel points because I never use them.

I think we're past me expecting you to put vowel points on the compositions.

But, it would be cool if we could all be expected to compose in a fuller sense. I mean, go ahead and look things up for help or to compare, but do the composition yourself first.

You can use an on-screen keyboard (they are native to Windows and iOS - and even telephones) or use a Hebrew virtual keyboard (like the one here) if you have troubles pulling one up.

That makes it a challenge and forces us to try to come up with it ourselves before leaning on how others or how the biblical text expresses it.

(6) David brought the priest near unto him and he inquired of [בּ] the Lord saying, ‘Wilt Thou give this city in my hand when I shall fight against it?’

Not sure about some of this.

Hidden Text

וָיַבִּיא דָוִד אֶת־הַכֹּהָנִים וַיִּשְׁאַל בַּיהוה לֵאמֹר הֲנָתַתָּ אֶת־הָעִיר הַזֶּה אֶל־יַדִּי כָאֲשֶׁר נִלְחֲמִי עַלֶיהָ