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Re: off topic Luke 12:20

Posted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 10:20 pm
by Jason Hare
Just like בעצמו means "by himself," so בעצם היום הזה means "on this very day." Also, כסיל is a noun. It is not a hiphil verb הכסיל.

Re: off topic Luke 12:20

Posted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 10:32 pm
by Jason Hare
Isaac Fried wrote:Here it is

וְהָאֱלֹהִים אָמַר לוֹ: אַתָּה הַכְּסִיל, בְּעֶצֶם הַלַּיְלָה הַזֶּה יִדְרְשׁוּ מִמְּךָ אֶת נַפְשֶׁךָ וַאֲשֶׁר הֲכִינוֹתָ לְּךָ לְמִי יִהְיֶה

Translation by IF: and God said to him: you fool, at this very (בעצם) night your soul will be demanded of you, and what you gathered will be to whom?

Isaac Fried, Boston University
This is precisely correct. The phrase בעצם goes with הלילה הזה and creates the concept of "this very night" (as opposed to some other day).

בלילה הזה = on this night
בעצם הלילה הזה = on this very night

We might think of it as "on this night itself" in the way that בעצמי is "by myself" and בעצמנו is "by ourselves" (without the assistance of others).

Re: off topic Luke 12:20

Posted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 10:35 pm
by Jason Hare
Jemoh66 wrote:Anyway I thought we could improve on Delitzsch's rendering ;)
Blasphemy! LOL

Actually, I think that the Bible Societies' translation is a huge improvement (since it uses more colloquial Hebrew). I really enjoy reading from the NT in that version. Have you looked at it?

Re: off topic Luke 12:20

Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 10:30 am
by Jemoh66
No Jason, I haven't. Will check it out.

Re: off topic Luke 12:20

Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 10:58 am
by Jemoh66
Jason Hare wrote:Just like בעצמו means "by himself," so בעצם היום הזה means "on this very day." Also, כסיל is a noun. It is not a hiphil verb הכסיל.
I agree. I was wondering why Karl saw a verb here. I read this as "You, the fool, in this selfsame night"