Mycenaean Hebrew

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Saboi
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Saboi » Fri Jul 27, 2018 12:47 pm

Linear B & Phoenician
Image
Lee Mcgee

Saboi
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Saboi » Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:00 pm

לאמ : λεῶν
לוֹן : λαόν * Land
נו : ῷν , νομός , νέμω
כי - ὅτι "That"
כה - οὕτως "Thus
גם - γοῦν "Well"
אמנה - ἦ μήν , εἶ μάν "verily, truly"
מקץ - μεθ /μετά "after that"
קץ - ἐθ/ἔτ "Yet"
יהי - ἰοί
ל ו - τό ὁ
אם - ἐὰν
לאתו - αὐτῷ
אתו - αὐτὸ
אתה - αὐτὴ
Last edited by Saboi on Fri Jul 27, 2018 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Lee Mcgee

talmid56
Posts: 68
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2013 9:02 am
Location: Carlisle, Arkansas, USA

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby talmid56 » Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:32 pm

The Phoenicians were traders who ranged the Mediterranean, including Greek-speaking areas. It is believed that the early Greeks borrowed the Phoenician script and adapted it. However, that does not mean they spoke the same language. There are numerous cases in history where a script is used for two languages that are unrelated. Yiddish, for example, uses Hebrew script but is European (medieval German dialect), not Semitic. Urdu, the current national language of Pakistan, is an Indo-Aryan language, but uses Arabic script. This however is due to religious reasons (Pakistan is a Muslim-majority country).
Dewayne Dulaney
דואיין דוליני

כִּ֤י שֶׁ֨מֶשׁ׀ וּמָגֵן֮ יְהוָ֪ה אֱלֹ֫הִ֥ים חֵ֣ן וְ֭כָבוֹד יִתֵּ֣ן יְהוָ֑ה לֹ֥א יִמְנַע־ט֝֗וֹב לַֽהֹלְכִ֥ים בְּתָמִֽים׃
--(E 84:11) 84:12 תהלים

Saboi
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Saboi » Fri Jul 27, 2018 7:56 pm

Phoenician Language was primarily used by Merchants, designed for that purpose, that is why the language omits vowels and sometimes
consonants to fit as much information on tablets that they had to ferry across the Mediterranean. Persian Empire adopted the script and stylised it into Imperial Aramaic and this is the origin of the Hebrew script, The Greek colony of Elephantine adopted Imperial Aramaic.

PHOENIX
- αἵματι φοινόν "Blood Red" ( Lliad 16:159)
- αἷμα 'Red'
- ϝοινος οἶνος "'Wine'
- δέμας 'bodily frame. inflorescence of the grape vine'
- δῆμος 'bodily fat, country-district'
- דם 'Blood'
- אדם 'Red, Man, Edom, Soil' (for the red soil of the Lebanese mountains)
- יין 'Wine'
- ים 'Sea' ( οἶνοψ πόντος )
- קין 'Cain, Kenite'
- קינן 'Cainan'
- יון 'Javan
- קנן 'Nest (of the Phoenix) *Jer 22:23, Num 24:21
- שמשון , שמ 'Samson, Shem'
- שני 'Scarlet'
- תמר 'Palm Tree, Tamar'
- יונה 'Jonah, Dove'
- חמד 'Red Wine, reddish donkey'
- שמר 'Wine
Lee Mcgee

Saboi
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Saboi » Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:34 pm

ראש
- κράς 'head, of men or animals, peak, top.
- κέρας 'Horn of an animal , branch of a river,
- κρανίον 'upper part of the head,
- Cornu ' branch of a river, horn of animal
- Brain

Head
- קד (Qad) 'Head, bow down'
- قبعة (Qabea) 'Hat'
- κύπτω, κύψᾶς 'bend one's head
- جبين (Jabiyn) 'Forhead
- κεφαλή 'Head
- Caput
- κίδαρις 'Persian headgear
- עטרת 'Crown
- جبل (Jabal) 'high-place
- גבה (Gabah) 'high place
- כִּיפָּה‬ (Kippah)
- גביעי (gĕbiya) 'bowl
- κούπα 'cup

יד (Yad) 'Hand (tool for measuring)
- מדד,מד 'Measure
- Medida (Spanish)
- Medir
- Metro
- משורה (mĕsuwrah) ''Measure''
- Mund, Manus, Mano, Hand
- μέτρον, μετρέω
- משפט
- ישר (yashar)
- εὐθύς, εὐθεῖα 'Straight

ילך (yalak) 'travel
- Walk
- τρέχω 'run
- τροχός 'wheel
- דרך (Derek)
- הלך
- הליכה
- רכב 'Chariot
- τρέω 'flee
- κελευθήτης 'wayfarer'
- Train, Tren
- Track, Tractor
- Recua, Reata, Raza
- March, Marcha, Marca
- Car, Cargar, Corriente, Curso, Barca, Correr
- Huir, Progreso, Traer
Lee Mcgee

Saboi
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Saboi » Fri Jul 27, 2018 9:02 pm

MAGI
- μηχανεύς "contriver, artificer"
- τέχνη 'art, skill, cunning of hand'
- מכנות 'Mekownah
- מחשבת
- המכבי 'Maccabeus
- כהן 'Kohen'
- διακονέω 'minister, do service
- διάκων 'servant, attendant, official
- קסם qecem

רפא (Rapha) Heal
- רפואה (rephuah) 'remedy'
- תרופה (Theruwphah)
- θεραπεία (Therapeia) 'Therapy

רפא עבד
- θεράπων 'Servant, Aid
- ὀπηδός 'Aide, Attendant, tiller' (Gen 2:15 )
- בית עבד = Hospital
- עבד : πάις, παιδός, παίδων
- ἰατρός (Iatros ) "Heal"
- יתרו "Jethro"
- רעואל < רפואל < יתרואל < יתרופאל ( Jethro Reuel)
- יתרו < ית-ר-פ < יתרפ > Ἀσκ-λ-ηπ > Ἀσκληπιός > Asclepius ( god of medicine )
- σωτηρία
Lee Mcgee

Saboi
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Saboi » Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:22 pm

talmid56 wrote:But Philistines are not Hebrews. And there is no such language as Mycenaean Hebrew, never has been. It's is just as fictional as Joseph Smith's "Reformed Egyptian".


The Philistines were expelled from Ancient Egypt during the reign of Ramses III into Southern Canaan around the
11th century BCE, but in the Bible, Philistines already inhabited the region and thus the events in the Torah must of occurred later.

Genesis 21:32 - Abraham sojourned in the Philistines'
Exodus 15:14 - Inhabitants of Palestina

Adad-Nirari III (Slab of Nimrud) *811 BC - 783 BC
[I subdued] from the bank of the Euphrates, the land of Hatti, the land of Amurru in its entirety, the land of Tyre, the land of Sidon, the land of Humri, the land of Edom, the land of Palastu, as far as the great sea of the setting sun. I imposed tax and tribute on them

This slab mentions Seven locations in the Levant from north to south
Hatti - Amurra - Tyre - Sidon - Humri - Edom - Palastu ( who's missing?)

ἠπείρω (Hebrews )

SAA 19 025 - Tiglath-Pileser III
Raid by the Ionians (ia-u-na-a-a) on the Syrian coast

Herodotus 7:89
Phoenicians formerly dwelt as they themselves say, by the Red Sea; they crossed from there and now
Lee Mcgee

talmid56
Posts: 68
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2013 9:02 am
Location: Carlisle, Arkansas, USA

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby talmid56 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:59 pm

You make the common mistake of believing the Bible's historical records are wrong until proven right. An assumption never made about extra-biblical historical sources, even those that invoke or pay homage to the deities of those peoples. That is not fair nor is it logical, as time and time again archaeology has proven the historical accuracy of the Bible beyond dispute. As for the Philistines, they apparently made several migrations over time from their homeland(s). No reason why they could not have come to live in Canaan more than once. And no scholar that I am aware of dates the events in the Torah later, just the writing of them. (If there are any, they are wrong. And the dating is wrong too.)

And for the last time, Hebrew and Greek are not related linguistically. "Hebrews" comes from the root עבר. It has no relation whatsoever to any Greek word. None.
Dewayne Dulaney
דואיין דוליני

כִּ֤י שֶׁ֨מֶשׁ׀ וּמָגֵן֮ יְהוָ֪ה אֱלֹ֫הִ֥ים חֵ֣ן וְ֭כָבוֹד יִתֵּ֣ן יְהוָ֑ה לֹ֥א יִמְנַע־ט֝֗וֹב לַֽהֹלְכִ֥ים בְּתָמִֽים׃
--(E 84:11) 84:12 תהלים

Saboi
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Saboi » Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:47 pm

talmid56 wrote:You make the common mistake of believing the Bible's historical records are wrong until proven right. An assumption never made about extra-biblical historical sources, even those that invoke or pay homage to the deities of those peoples. That is not fair nor is it logical, as time and time again archaeology has proven the historical accuracy of the Bible beyond dispute. As for the Philistines, they apparently made several migrations over time from their homeland(s). No reason why they could not have come to live in Canaan more than once. And no scholar that I am aware of dates the events in the Torah later, just the writing of them. (If there are any, they are wrong. And the dating is wrong too.)

And for the last time, Hebrew and Greek are not related linguistically. "Hebrews" comes from the root עבר. It has no relation whatsoever to any Greek word. None.


עבר
- ὑπέρ 'Beyond, Over
- περάω 'pass right across
- ἠπείρω 'to make into mainland
- πορεύω 'pass through, traverse

I never brought up the Philistines in this thread but they are probably what the Greeks call the 'Palesgoi ('πελασ-γοί)
or ή πάραλος γῆ "people of the Coast land".

The story of Abraham is filled with anachronism because the Bible is not in the chronological order of the Books
and they are no dates or time stamps in the Torah.

Genesis 11:31 - Exodus
Genesis 18:5 - Passover
Genesis 26:5 - Torah & Commandments

תורת - θεωρέω, θεωρεῖται 'to be sent to consult an oracle, observe'
Lee Mcgee

Isaac Fried
Posts: 1099
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 8:32 pm

Re: Mycenaean Hebrew

Postby Isaac Fried » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:30 pm

תלמיד

You declare: "And for the last time, Hebrew and Greek are not related linguistically. "Hebrews" comes from the root עבר. It has no relation whatsoever to any Greek word. None."

Yet, I would be careful about emphatic, sweeping and absolute statements, and perpetuated academic (= a-qadem-ic, namely the wisdom of קֶדֶם QEDEM) dogma. I would agree that Lee's exuberant posts are, indeed, possibly, vague and diffused. He is excited about something that others have already noticed before him, but has not yet come to articulated and organize.

Greek is undeniably Indo-European (yet related to Sanskrit of the far east), while Hebrew is Semitic. yet eastern tribes wandering into Greece possibly carried with them, and preserved, ancient eastern everyday terms, say, names of plants and animals. I suspect that "corn" and "oil" are two such words. The same is true, methinks, about mythological names.

Moreover, Greek, or Indo-European in general, and Hebrew may harbor a very basic, stealthy, ancient connection at their very foundation, by way of shared fundamental root-concepts. Take, for instance, the common word ὑπέρ (over = ov-er, up, upper = up-er), which apparently corresponds to the Hebrew אב, עב, אף, עף with the appended IE -er, 'it is'. Consider also the two household words pater = pat-er, 'father', and mater = mat-er, 'mother'. It is conceivable that the fraction PAT of pater is the eastern פת = פ-את as in בת = ב-את (or אב-את), and that the ending -ER (as in "her"), is an IE pileup. Similarly, mat-er = אם-את plus the IE -er. Recall the piled-up word children = child-r-n, German: Kind, Kinder.

Isaac Fried, Boston University


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