Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

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Jason Hare
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Re: Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

Post by Jason Hare »

For everyone's reference, the B-Hebrew archive from before the forum setup is here: https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-hebrew

A relevant part of the archive may be entitled "5th century BCE to 3rd century CE sociolinguistics (Buth, Kilmon)" as found here.

Mr. Randolph's first contributions to the listserv were from May 2003 and can be viewed here.

Nothing has been deleted from the archives, so far as I am aware.
Jason Hare
Tel Aviv, Israel
The Hebrew Café
יוֹדֵ֣עַ צַ֭דִּיק נֶ֣פֶשׁ בְּהֶמְתּ֑וֹ וְֽרַחֲמֵ֥י רְ֝שָׁעִ֗ים אַכְזָרִֽי׃
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Jason Hare
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Re: Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

Post by Jason Hare »

You all might find the discussion of Hebrew as a spoken language from June 2003 interesting, "When did Hebrew cease to be a commonly spoken language?"

It is found here: https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-h ... html#start

Notice that B-Hebrew was an email listserv for several years before we moved to the forum format.
Jason Hare
Tel Aviv, Israel
The Hebrew Café
יוֹדֵ֣עַ צַ֭דִּיק נֶ֣פֶשׁ בְּהֶמְתּ֑וֹ וְֽרַחֲמֵ֥י רְ֝שָׁעִ֗ים אַכְזָרִֽי׃
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Jason Hare
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Re: Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

Post by Jason Hare »

Interestingly, Mr. Randolph said in the above-mentioned thread that:
Karl Randolph wrote:I don’t have proof for my belief that Hebrew ceased being the everyday, common language, nor even strong evidence, just a haunch [sic, hunch] based on disparate clues, and my belief could very well be wrong.
[source: https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-h ... 15544.html]
It seems that he was more willing to admit to it being a hunch in the past. I wonder what has changed.
Jason Hare
Tel Aviv, Israel
The Hebrew Café
יוֹדֵ֣עַ צַ֭דִּיק נֶ֣פֶשׁ בְּהֶמְתּ֑וֹ וְֽרַחֲמֵ֥י רְ֝שָׁעִ֗ים אַכְזָרִֽי׃
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kwrandolph
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Re: Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

Post by kwrandolph »

Jason Hare wrote: Fri Oct 01, 2021 4:02 pm For everyone's reference, the B-Hebrew archive from before the forum setup is here: https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-hebrew

A relevant part of the archive may be entitled "5th century BCE to 3rd century CE sociolinguistics (Buth, Kilmon)" as found here.

Mr. Randolph's first contributions to the listserv were from May 2003 and can be viewed here.
Nope. Not one of those messages was my very first entry into b-hebrew.

I remember my very first message. It was entered into a thread discussing whether or not Jeremiah was literate. It took a couple of days for other people to notice it. All it said was, “Jeremiah 51:60”. Nothing more. I thought that was sufficient to answer the thread.
Jason Hare wrote: Fri Oct 01, 2021 4:02 pm Nothing has been deleted from the archives, so far as I am aware.
Years ago, shortly after we relocated to our present site, I decided to look at some of the threads in which I had been active. Not only did I see individual entries missing, but even whole threads. Now years later, I don’t remember which ones they were, I didn’t keep a written record of my search, but that was enough to tell me there are missing records in that archive.
Jason Hare wrote: Fri Oct 01, 2021 5:42 pm Interestingly, Mr. Randolph said in the above-mentioned thread that:
Karl Randolph wrote:I don’t have proof for my belief that Hebrew ceased being the everyday, common language, nor even strong evidence, just a haunch [sic, hunch] based on disparate clues, and my belief could very well be wrong.
[source: https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-h ... 15544.html]
It seems that he was more willing to admit to it being a hunch in the past. I wonder what has changed.
Evaluation of more data. Further analysis of the claims in favor of Hebrew continuing to be used. Willingness to follow the data instead of my heart.

I originally was in favor of the theory that Hebrew was a vernacular in late second temple times. Just as a big ship at sea takes miles to turn around, so it’s taken me a while to re-evaluate and come to the conclusions I now have.

Karl W. Randolph.
Last edited by kwrandolph on Sat Oct 02, 2021 12:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Chris Watts
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Re: Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

Post by Chris Watts »

Jason Hare wrote: Fri Oct 01, 2021 4:02 pm For everyone's reference, the B-Hebrew archive from before the forum setup is here: https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-hebrew

A relevant part of the archive may be entitled "5th century BCE to 3rd century CE sociolinguistics (Buth, Kilmon)" as found here.

Mr. Randolph's first contributions to the listserv were from May 2003 and can be viewed here.

Nothing has been deleted from the archives, so far as I am aware.
Thanks Jason, very helpful and will scour what others have said certainly.
Chris Watts
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Joined: Thu May 13, 2021 8:00 am

Re: Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

Post by Chris Watts »

kwrandolph wrote: Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:11 am I originally was in favor of the theory that Hebrew was a vernacular in late second temple times. Just as a big ship at sea takes miles to turn around, so it’s taken me a while to re-evaluate and come to the conclusions I now have.

Karl W. Randolph.
Maybe the ship was already going in the right direction :lol:

chris watts
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Jason Hare
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Re: Stand-Alone Perfect and Imperfect examples with identical 'time' meanings

Post by Jason Hare »

Chris Watts wrote: Sat Oct 02, 2021 10:24 am Thanks Jason, very helpful and will scour what others have said certainly.
B-Hebrew used to have some real power hitters. The archives are filled with great information. Happy hunting!

Jason
Jason Hare
Tel Aviv, Israel
The Hebrew Café
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