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Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 4:14 pm
by ducky
Hi Jason,
Yes, I figured that this how you read it, and as you said, this is why we differed in out translation in this part.
I also think that we talked about it enough and you can go to the next exercise.
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 4:19 pm
by Jason Hare
Here's the next sentence!
(3) The priest of the city came forth and he blessed Abraham and he said: ‘Blessed art though to the Lord who hath given thin enemies in thy hand; and now give (to) us the people, and the gold and the silver take thou for thyself’.
Some of this looks like bad English to me. It might lead to some disagreements.
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 4:23 pm
by Jason Hare
(3) The priest of the city came forth and he blessed Abraham and he said: ‘Blessed art thou to the Lord who hath given thine enemies in thy hand; and now give (to) us the people, and the gold and the silver take thou for thyself’.
My submission:
- Hidden Text
וַיֵּצֵא כֹּהֵן הָעִיר וַיְבָ֫רֶךְ אֶת־אַבְרָהָם וַיֹּ֫אמֶר בָּרוּךְ אַתָּה לַיהוָה אֲשֶׁר נָתַן בְּיָֽדְךָ אֶת־אֹיְבֶ֫יךָ וְעַתָּה תֶּן־לָ֫נוּ אֶת־הָאֲנָשִׁים וְקַח לְךָ אֶת־הַזָּהָב וְאֶת־הַכֶּ֫סֶף׃
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 4:57 pm
by S_Walch
My attempt:
- Hidden Text
יצא כהן עיר ויברך את אברהם ויאמר ברוך אתה ליהוה אשר נתן בידך את איביך ועתה תנה לנו את עם ולקחת את זהב ואת כסף לך
יָצָא כֹּהֵן עִיר וַיְּבָרֶךְ אֶת־אַבְרָהָם וַיֹּאמֶר בָּרוּךְ אַתָּה לְיהוה אֲשֶׁר נָתַן בְּיָדֶךָ אֶת־אֹיְבֶיךָ וְעַתָּה תְּנָה־לָּנוּ אֶת־עַם וְלָקַחְתָ אֶת־זָהָב וְאֶת־כֶּסֶף לְךָ
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 6:08 pm
by ducky
- Hidden Text
וַיֵּצֵא כֹהֵן הָעִיר לִקְרַאת אַבְרָהָם וַיְבָרְכֵהוּ וַיֹּאמַר בָּרוּךְ אַתָּה לַי"י אֲשֶׁר נָתַן אֶת אֹיְבֶיךָ בְיָדֶךָ וְעַתָּה תֶּן לָנוּ אֶת הָאֲנָשִים וְאֶת הַזָּהָב וְהַכֶּסֶף קַח לָךְ
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 6:19 pm
by ducky
Jason Hare wrote:(3) The priest of the city came forth and he blessed Abraham and he said: ‘Blessed art though to the Lord who hath given thine enemies in thy hand; and now give (to) us the people, and the gold and the silver take thou for thyself’.
My submission:
- Hidden Text
וַיֵּצֵא כֹּהֵן הָעִיר וַיְבָ֫רֶךְ אֵת אַבְרָהָם וַיֹּ֫אמֶר בָּרוּךְ אַתָּה לַיהוָה אֲשֶׁר נָתַן לְיָֽדְךָ אֶת אֹיְבֶ֫יךָ וְעַתָּה תֵּן לָ֫נוּ אֵת הָעָם וְלָקַחְתָּ לְךָ אֵת הַזָּהָב וְאֵת הַכֶּ֫סֶף׃
Hi Jason,
Why did you write נתן לידך?
This kind of combination in that meaning is very common.
I have a feeling that it is a typo or something?
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 6:27 pm
by ducky
S_Walch wrote:My attempt:
- Hidden Text
יצא כהן עיר ויברך את אברהם ויאמר ברוך אתה ליהוה אשר נתן בידך את איביך ועתה תנה לנו את עם ולקחת את זהב ואת כסף לך
יָצָא כֹּהֵן עִיר וַיְּבָרֶךְ אֶת־אַבְרָהָם וַיֹּאמֶר בָּרוּךְ אַתָּה לְיהוה אֲשֶׁר נָתַן בְּיָדֶךָ אֶת־אֹיְבֶיךָ וְעַתָּה תְּנָה־לָּנוּ אֶת־עַם וְלָקַחְתָ אֶת־זָהָב וְאֶת־כֶּסֶף לְךָ
Hi Ste Walch,
Just a few things to check
1. כהן עיר - it is indeed a valid construction, but now try to translate it back to English and see what you get and if it fits the English source.
2. ידך - check the vowels.
this word can be voweled in two ways.
each one according to the position of the word.
3. את־עם / את־זהב / את־כסף
What does את represent?
it is a prefix of what?
and what is missing in your writing?
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 7:07 pm
by Jason Hare
ducky wrote:Hi Jason,
Why did you write נתן לידך?
This kind of combination in that meaning is very common.
I have a feeling that it is a typo or something?
Yes, it should be בידך instead of לידך.
Mea culpa.
תֻּקַּן
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Thu May 21, 2020 3:50 am
by S_Walch
ducky wrote:1. כהן עיר - it is indeed a valid construction, but now try to translate it back to English and see what you get and if it fits the English source.
Ah right, should have some definite articles this time round!
הָעִיר
2. ידך - check the vowels.
this word can be voweled in two ways.
each one according to the position of the word.
בְיָדְךָ ?
3. את־עם / את־זהב / את־כסף
What does את represent?
it is a prefix of what?
and what is missing in your writing?
I was using it as the direct-object marker, which I'm 99.9% sure is right for this.
Guessing I should be having some definite articles along with them:
אֶת־הַעַם /
אֶת־הַזָהָב /
אֶת־הַכֶּסֶף
Re: Weingreen Composition - Chapter 30 and On
Posted: Thu May 21, 2020 12:00 pm
by ducky
Hi Ste Walch,
S_Walch wrote:2. ידך - check the vowels.
this word can be voweled in two ways.
each one according to the position of the word.
בְיָדְךָ ?
Yes. But don't forget the Dagesh in the prefix ב.
יָדְךָ is the context form.
יָדֶךָ is the pausal form.
You chose to write:
"who hath given in thy hand thine enemies"
And so the word Hand is inside the sentence. So it gets its context form.
If you chose to write: who hath given thine enemies in thy hand,
then the word Hand is at the end of the sentence and it will get the pausal form.
S_Walch wrote:3. את־עם / את־זהב / את־כסף
What does את represent?
it is a prefix of what?
and what is missing in your writing?
I was using it as the direct-object marker, which I'm 99.9% sure is right for this.
Guessing I should be having some definite articles along with them:
אֶת־הַעַם /
אֶת־הַזָהָב /
אֶת־הַכֶּסֶף
[/quote]
The main thing here is the "the". the prefix ה.
the word את is bound to it.
So when you want to write a definite word, first pay attention that you use the "the".
you can even not write the word את.
As only write: והזהב והכסף.
(and notice that the העם is written with Qamats on the definite article)