Three Words for Man

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Chris Watts
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Three Words for Man

Post by Chris Watts »

These three words that mean "Man" in hebrew, or "mankind", but mainly "Man":
אדם אישׂ זכר
My focus is on the first word above, it is used most frequently to refer to a "Male" most used in the first 5 books of Moses. However my questions pertain to the use outside of these books to refer to 'Man' as man.

1. Why do you think that the writer would choose this word over the other two most commonly used words? I can understand it being used in Jeremiah 20:15, since this would presumably have a connotation of passing on the family son to son so to speak. But not in Jeremiah 30:6 for example, unless this could refer to all males from little children to very old men?

2. What seems to be the connection with 'Remembering', or why did the verb 'To remember' become suddenly a noun used to mean "man"?

Chris watts
ducky
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by ducky »

Hi,

Basically, the איש has more essence of אדם.
So אדם can be just a male person. And איש is a man.
David Hunter
Isaac Fried
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by Isaac Fried »

Chris writes
What seems to be the connection with 'Remembering', or why did the verb 'To remember' become suddenly a noun used to mean "man"?
The verb 'To remember' did not become "suddenly" a noun used to mean "man". Rather, both share the common root זכר.
I have repeatedly remarked here that Hebrew words derived from the same root need not have anything in common.
The root זכר is a variant of the roots סכר, שכר, סגר, meaning 'kept, enclosed, retained, conserved, swelled', in his mind.
זכר as "male', is possibly related to the post-biblical זקר, 'rise, become erect, swell, toss up', for being tall. Or for possibly encompassing the female.

Isaac Fried, Boston University
www.hebrewetymology.com
kwrandolph
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by kwrandolph »

Chris Watts wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 4:45 pm These three words that mean "Man" in hebrew, or "mankind", but mainly "Man":
אדם אישׂ זכר
My focus is on the first word above, it is used most frequently to refer to a "Male" most used in the first 5 books of Moses. However my questions pertain to the use outside of these books to refer to 'Man' as man.
This is an example of poor lexicography.

‎זכר male of a species, usually used in reference to men, but also for animals Gn 7:3, 9, 16, Jr 30:6, Ml 1:14 used in contrast to נקבה female of a species

‎איש man, a male of the human species: though occasionally it refers to a generalized individual in a use similar to a pronoun, not necessarily human, e.g. gods 2K 18:33, animals Gn 7:2

‎אדם man, person (everyone’s skin is reddish, even though our eyes may not notice it), mankind Gn 1:26–7, 2:5, 5:2, 7:21, 23 (similar to the use of the Greek word ανθρωπος)

As you can see, there are differences in meaning between the words.
Chris Watts wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 4:45 pm 1. Why do you think that the writer would choose this word over the other two most commonly used words? I can understand it being used in Jeremiah 20:15, since this would presumably have a connotation of passing on the family son to son so to speak. But not in Jeremiah 30:6 for example, unless this could refer to all males from little children to very old men?
Jeremiah 30:6 does any male give birth?
Chris Watts wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 4:45 pm 2. What seems to be the connection with 'Remembering', or why did the verb 'To remember' become suddenly a noun used to mean "man"?
This is a common fallacy. While it is true that many nouns and adjectives are derived from verbs (true also for English) that is not true for all nouns and adjectives in Hebrew. Secondly, just because a noun and verb may share the same letters, does not mean that the noun is derived from that verb. After all, there are homonyms, and in Hebrew homographs. I see no connection between remembering and male of a species.

Karl W. Randolph.
Chris Watts
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by Chris Watts »

Hallo David, Thankyou for replying

You said: <<<<Basically, the איש has more essence of אדם.
So אדם can be just a male person. And איש is a man.>>>> Maybe I should have said the third word on the left since this is hebrew and I was numbering in English from left to right because - The wordזכר is what I was asking about.

Hallo Karl, thankyou for replying

You said: <<<<Jeremiah 30:6 does any male give birth?>>>> No I know what this means, my question is focused on why the writer would have chosen זכר rather than the other two most commonly used words? This word has a subtle different connotation to refer to all males, even sacrificial ones and maybe the idea of 'sacrifice of innocence' is a shade lying underneath his choice of words? Just a proposal.

What is 'Noticeable' is he then changes to גבר just a few words later. Maybe the idea contrasting the innocence of the first word with the idea of Strength by using the second word? Each word carefully chosen says something otherwise he would have used the most common words for 'man'.

Opinions?

Chris watts
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Jason Hare
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by Jason Hare »

From HALOT...
זָכָר‎: II זכר‎; Jerome zochor, Ex 17:14 MS זֶכֶר‎: MHb. man, male animal, phallus; Ug. dakaru man AfO 19:194b; Arm. (זכר‎ and) דכר‎ (→ BArm.) DISO 77, Arb. ḏakar, OSArb. ḏkr; Akk. zak(a)ru, zikaru (MAOG 11/1-2:23ff; CAD 21:23, 110f); etym. unknown: ? basic meaning phallus (BL 462r): זְכָרִים‎; commonly collective: —1. man, male person :: נְקֵבָה‎; זָ׳ וּנְ׳ (EgArm. Nab. JArm. Montgomery Incantation Texts 6:2f) Gn 1:27 5:2 6:19 7:2 (Sam., Sept.), 3, 9, 16 Lv 3:1, 6 12:7 15:33 Nu 5:3 Dt 4:16 Lv 27:5-7; כָּל־זָ׳‎ every male Gn 17:10, 12, 23 34:15, 22, 24f Ex 12:48 Lv 6:11, 22 7:6 Nu 1:2, 20, 22 3:15, 22, 28, 34, 39 18:10 26:62 31:7, 17 Ju 21:11 1K 11:15f 2C 31:19; עָרֵל זָ׳‎ Gn 17:14; זָ׳ Lv 12:2 Is 66:7 and בֵּן זָ׳ Jr 20:15 male child, בְּכֹר זָ׳‎ first-born males Nu 3:40, 43; זְכָרִים‎ men Ex 13:12, 15 Jos 5:4 17:2 Ezr 8:3-14 2C 31:16; צַלְמֵי זָ׳‎ images of men (phalli ?, → זְכוּר‎ and זִכָּרוֹן‎ 4) Ezk 16:17; שָׁכַב אֵת זָ׳‎ homosexual activity Lv 18:22 20:13; מִשְׁכַּב ז׳‎ female sexual intercourse with a man Nu 31:17f, 35 Ju 21:11f; זָ׳‎ is unable to bear a child Jr 30:6; —2. male animal especially ram, meaning derived from Arm., Ex 12:5 cj. 34:19 Lv 1:3, 10 3:1 4:23 22:19 Dt 15:19, Mal 1:14 (cj. זָכֶה‎ flawless). †

Ludwig Koehler et al., The Hebrew and Aramaic Lexicon of the Old Testament (Leiden: E.J. Brill, 1994–2000), 270–271.
I אָדָם‎, (only abs.; ca. 540 ×, 49 × in Qoh, Dahood Qoh. 34f): MHb. אדן‎ (Kutscher Mish. Hb. 37), Ug. adm people (|| lim = לְאֹם‎ Is 43:4), Ph. man אדם‎, pl. אדמם, DISO 4; Arm. only JArm.b; mankind; OSArb. slave > Arb. (ibn) ʾādam man, Tigr. ʾaddām (Wb. 384a) mankind; etym. unc., אָדֹם‎ red (VG 2:48; Pedersen Berytus 6:72) or Arb. ʾadam skin (Bauer ZA 28:310f): mankind-man-Adam (→ II) (Koehler Theol. 113f; ThZ 1:77f; Pedersen Isr. 1-2, 61f, 110; Vriezen Par. 130ff); → אֱנוֹשׁ‎: —1. coll. mankind, people, a) construed with pl.: זָֽעֲקוּ הָא׳‎ Jr 47:2, כָּל־א׳ חָזוּ‎ Jb 36:25, b) usually construed with sg. Dt 8:3 1S 25:29 Is 2:20; c) → בֵּן‎ 4; בְּנֵי א׳‎ (38 ×) Dt 32:8 and בְּנֵי הָא׳‎ (9 ×, Da 10:16 rd. בֶּן־א׳‎) Gn 11:5 individual men = males, like בְּנוֹת א׳‎ women Gn 6:2, 4; בֶּן־א׳‎ individual man (like בֶּן־בָּקָר‎, → בֵּן‎ 4) Ezk 2:1-47:6 (ca. 90 ×) and Nu 23:19 Is 51:12 56:2 Jr 49:18, 33 50:40 51:43 Ps 8:5 80:18 146:3 Jb 16:21 (rd. וּבֵין בֶּן־‎) 25:6 35:8 Da 8:17 cj. 10:16; בַּת א׳‎ not found; d) in cs. phrases: of man, human: לֵב א׳‎ Gn 8:21, יְדֵי א׳‎ Dt 4:28 (8 ×), דַּם א׳‎ Gn 9:6; כְּסִיל א׳‎ a fool of a man Pr 15:20, פֶּרֶא א׳‎ Gn 16:12 (GK §128 l); e) in apposition (GK §131b) א׳ בְּלִיַּעַל‎ men who are corrupters = corruptively Pr 6:12, cf. א׳ רשׁעה‎ 1QS 119; f) with negation: א׳ … לֹא‎ Ps 105:14 and א׳ לֹא‎ Lv 16:17 Jb 32:21 nobody, אֵין א׳‎ no man 2C 6:36; —2. individual man (late and sporadic, in most cases the collective interpretation is possible): בְּאָ׳‎ (touch) somebody Lv 22:5 אָ׳ כִּי‎ if somebody Lv 13:2 Nu 19:14, הָאָ׳ לָאָ׳‎ one to the other Pr 27:19; —3. Gn 1-5: 1:26-30 coll. mankind (Boehmer ZAW 34:31ff; in Gn 2f, trad. the first man like הָאִישׁ‎; coll. also in Gn 2f (cj. 2:20b and 3:17b and 21, rd. לָאָ׳‎ cf. 3:20) 5:1b, 2 :: 4:25 5:1a, 3-5, → III אָדָם‎ —rd. אֲרָם‎ Ju 18:7, 28 Is 22:6 Zech 9:1 (:: Zolli VT 5:90f) and Ps 76:11 (→ חֲמָת‎); 1K 5:11 ? rd. הָאֲדֹמִים‎ :: Noth Könige 82, Dt 20:19 rd. הֶאדם‎(: הֲ‎), 1S 17:32 rd. אֲדֹנִי (Sept.); ? Is 43:4 rd. אֲדָמוֹת‎, 47:3 rd. אָמַר‎ (conn. with גֹּאֲלֵנוּ‎ verse 4), Jr 51:14 ? rd. אֹיְבִים (Rudolph); Hos 6:7 rd. (III) בְּאָדָם‎, Zech 13:5 rd. (קִנְיָנִי‎) אֲדָמָה‎; Ps 17:4 rd. דָם (Gunkel), Pr 30:14 rd. מֵאֲדָמָה‎.

Ludwig Koehler et al., The Hebrew and Aramaic Lexicon of the Old Testament (Leiden: E.J. Brill, 1994–2000), 14.

I אִישׁ‎ (2160 ×), אִשׁ‎ cj. Ezk 8:2, Jerome eis, his, is BL 616d; MHb.; אישׁ‎ Lach., אשׁ‎ Siloam, Moab., Ph. (Poenulus 935 ys); OArm., Zakir, Yaud., Sef., EgArm., Pehl., Palm. (1 ×, Rosenthal Spr. 99) Hatra (DISO 26); OSArb. ʾ(y)s someone, anybody ZAW 75:306; etym. unc., ? I אשׁשׁ‎ (Elliger Fschr. Alt 1:100f): cs. id.; sffx. אִישִׁי‎ (Jerome issi), pl. later אִישִׁים‎ Is 53:3 Ps 141:4 (v.i.) Pr 8:4 † (only this form in Ph., Pun.), in all other instances אֲנָשִׁים‎ (: אנשׁ‎), אַנְשֵׁי‎, Jb 34:10 Len. אַנְשֵׁי‎, אֲנָשָׁיו‎, אַנְשֵׁיהֶם‎: —1. man (:: woman אִשָּׁה‎ Gn 2:24 Lv 15:18, also said of animals Gn 7:2 :: animal Ex 11:7 Ps 22:7; :: God Gn 32:29 Nu 23:19 Hos 11:9, אֵל‎ = לֹא אִישׁ‎ Is 31:8 Jb 9:32 32:13; procreator Qoh 6:3, male child Gn 4:1, זֶרַע אֲנָשִׁים‎ male offspring 1S 1:11, = manly one 1S 4:9 26:15 1K 2:2; —2. husband Gn 3:6, 16 16:3 29:32, 34 Lv 21:7 Nu 30:7, אִישׁ חֵיקָהּ‎ Dt 28:56, metaph. God :: people Hos 2:18; —3. indication of rank: a) בְּנֵי אִישׁ‎ the distinguished people Ps 4:3 49:3; b) governor of lower rank, amēlu in EA, Taanach, Mari: אִישׁ טוֹב‎ || מֶלֶךְ‎ 2S 10:6, 8 (Jirku ZAW 62:319); —4. human being: אַמַּת אִישׁ‎ common cubit Dt 3:11, שֵׁבֶט אֲנָשִׁים‎ rod used by men 2S 7:14; בְּנֵי אִישׁ‎ sons of man, mortals Ps 62:10 (|| בְּנֵי אָדָם‎ :: Ps 49:3, → Cazelles OTS 13:141f, אֶרֶץ לֹא־אִישׁ‎ void of men || מִדְבָּר‎ Jb 38:26; —5. אִישׁ‎ indicates a position, occupation, public office; a) with apposition: אִישׁ כֹּהֵן‎ Lv 21:9 , אִ׳ נָבִיא‎ Ju 6:8, אִ׳ סָרִיס‎ Jr 38:7, אִ׳ שַׂר וְשׁוֹפֵט‎ Ex 2:14 הָאִ׳ אֲדֹנֵי הָאָרֶץ‎ Gn 42:30; b) with genitive: אִישׁ הָאֲדָמָה‎ farmer Gn 9:20, אַנְשֵׁי אֳנִיּוֹת‎ sailors 1K 9:27, אַ׳ מִלְחָמָה‎ warriors Jl 2:7, אַ׳ מוֹפֵת‎ bearers of foreboding Zech 3:8, אַ׳ הַשֵּׁם‎ men of renown Gn 6:4, א׳ בְּשֹׂרָה‎ messenger 2S 18:20 א׳ מַתָּן‎ generous Pr 19:6, → אִ׳ הַבֵּנַיִם‎ champion 1S 17:4, א׳ רֵעִים‎ everybody’s friend Pr 18:24, אִ׳ חֶרְמִי‎ the man under my ban 1K 20:42; אִ׳ חַיִל‎ → חַיִל‎ 2b; —6. אִישׁ אֱלֹהִיםman of God: אִישׁ הָא׳‎ only in those instances where the combination is determined, 1S 9:7f :: 9:6; 1K 13:4ff :: 13:1; no exact indication of rank; originally as Arb. ḏū ʾilāhin owner of a mind, inspired being (Hölscher Profeten 1271 :: Junker Proph. 77f; Haldar 126ff); honorific description of someone especially near to God, Lindblom 60f, 73; Noth Personennamen 138f; a) prophets, || נָבִיא‎ and seers: Samuel 1S 9:6-10, Elijah 1K 17:18, 24 2K 1:9-13; Elisha 2K 4:7-13:19; שְׁמַעְיָה‎ 1K 12:22 2C 11:2, חָנָן Jr 35:4; nameless 1S 2:27; 1K 13:1-31 + 2K 23:16f; 1K 20:28; 2C 25:7, 9; b) in a broader sense: Moses Dt 33:1 Jos 14:6 Ps 90:1 Ezr 3:2 1C 23:14 2C 30:16; David Neh 12:24, 36 2C 8:14; c) Ju 13:6, 8 man sent by God (? dl. אֱלֹהִים‎: Budde KHComm. 95). † —7. אֲנָשִׁים‎ in association with someone: אַנְשֵׁי הַבַּיִת the servants Gn 39:11, אַ׳ דָוִד‎ David’s men 1S 23:3, אַ׳ הָאָרֶץ‎ the inhabitants Lv 18:27, of a town Ezr 2:22-28; —8. אִישׁ‎ / אַנְשֵׁי‎ indicates association within a community: אַ׳ נִינְוֵה‎ Jon 3:5 אַ׳ יִשְׂרָאֵל‎ men of Israel 1S 7:11; אִ׳ עִבְרִי‎ a Hebrew, אִ׳ מִצְרִי‎ Ex 2:11 אִ׳ יְהוּדִי‎ Zech 8:23; coll. אִ׳ יְהוּדָה‎ the men of Judah Is 5:3, אִ׳ יִשְׂרָאֵל‎ Jos 9:6 (:: Grintz JAOS 86:117ff: the oldest) Ju 7:23 :: a man of Israel Ju 7:14; —9. אִישׁsomebody, impersonal Gn 13:16 Ex 12:4 16:19, 2S 16:23 (Q without K), לֹא … אִ׳‎ Gn 23:6 and א׳ … לֹא‎ Jos 10:8 and אַל … אִ׳‎ Ex 16:19 nobody אֵין אִ׳‎ none Gn 39:11; אֲנָשִׁים‎ some Ex 16:20; —10. אִישׁ‎ each: חֲלֹמוֹ‎ Gn 40:5, אִ׳ תַּחְתָּיו‎ each man in his place Ex 16:29; הָאִישׁ‎ everyone 1S 26:23 † (= אֲנִי‎ ?, cf. JArmg ההוא גברא‎, Dalman Gr. 108f); —11. to express reciprocity: each other אִ׳ אָחִיו‎ Gn 9:5, אִ׳ אִישׁוֹ‎ 1K 20:20, אִ׳ רֵעֵהוּ‎ and אִ׳ קְרֹבוֹ‎: Ex 32:27, with אֶל‎ (Kuhr 14f); —12. every = each one in his turn: לְאִ׳‎ every man’s Jr 23:36 (alt. each one’s, as 10); אִ׳ אִישׁ‎ Lv 17:13 and אִ׳ וְאִישׁ‎ Ps 87:5 and אִ׳ וָאִישׁ‎ Est 1:8 every man, whoever he may be (Striedl ZAW 55:74); —1S 17:12 rd. בַּשָׁנִים‎; 1K 10:15 rd. עָנְשֵׁי‎ (: עֹנֶשׁ‎); Jr 20:16 ? rd. הַיּוֹם‎; Ez 24:17 and 22 rd. אֹנִים‎ (: אֹנֶה‎); Mi 6:10 rd. הַאֶשֶּׁה‎ (: נשׁה‎); Ps 37:37f rd. יָשָׁר‎; 64:7 prp. נֹאָשׁ‎ (: יאשׁ‎ nif.); 141:4 rd. בַּל אֵשֵׁ[ב עִ]ם‎ for אֶת־אִישִׁים‎; Pr 18:24 → אִשׁ‎; 2C 9:7 rd. נָשֶׁיךָ‎; 2C 9:14 rd. אַנְשֵׁי הַתָּרִים‎ travelling people: 1K 10:15 → Rudolph :: BH.
Der. n.m. אִישׁוֹן‎ *אָשִׁישׁאִישׁ־בֹשֶׁתאִישְׁהוֹדאֶשְׁבַּעַל‎ (?), יִשָׂשכָר‎ (?), יִשְׁבַּעַל‎. †

Ludwig Koehler et al., The Hebrew and Aramaic Lexicon of the Old Testament (Leiden: E.J. Brill, 1994–2000), 43–44.
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ducky
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by ducky »

Chris Watts wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 4:54 am my question is focused on why the writer would have chosen זכר rather than the other two most commonly used words? This word has a subtle different connotation to refer to all males, even sacrificial ones, and maybe the idea of 'sacrifice of innocence' is a shade lying underneath his choice of words? Just a proposal.

What is 'Noticeable' is he then changes to גבר just a few words later. Maybe the idea of contrasting the innocence of the first word with the idea of Strength by using the second word? Each word carefully chosen says something otherwise he would have used the most common words for 'man'.

Opinions?

Chris watts
Hi Chris,
I also think that it is a matter of construction.
But I think that it is maybe a matter of a mockery.

because זכר is more of a general objective word for a male, but then He moves to the dignified men, to mock them and see them "cry" as women (opposing to every other common male).
David Hunter
Chris Watts
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by Chris Watts »

Hallo Jason, well thankyou for the time you took to post that, permit me to say however I still find my 1885 edition of Tragelles much easier on the eyes, not to mention more human friendly?

David I believe you make a good point. Thankyou.

chris watts
Isaac Fried
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by Isaac Fried »

Karl writes
אדם man, person (everyone’s skin is reddish, even though our eyes may not notice it)
There is nothing between אדם, 'man', and אדום, 'red'.
This is an example of poor lexicography.
Yes, it surely is.

Isaac Fried, Boston University
www.hebrewetymology.com
Chris Watts
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Re: Three Words for Man

Post by Chris Watts »

Isaac Fried wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 6:12 pm Karl writes
אדם man, person (everyone’s skin is reddish, even though our eyes may not notice it)
There is nothing between אדם, 'man', and אדום, 'red'.
This is an example of poor lexicography.
Yes, it surely is.

Isaac Fried, Boston University
www.hebrewetymology.com
I hope that I have understood you correctly Isaac, that you say there is no connection between adam and Red? What about Isaiah 63:2 and song of songs where it mention the red chheks ? Also in Genesis the same word that is used for man is used for the earth (though in feminine I think), and the earth/dust though being of different colours around the world is strictly speaking dominated with a light reddish colour, and the fact that blood is red, (though I realise this is NOT strictly hebrew grammar it is interesting that if you take God ( the א out of Man) you are left with דם ).
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